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Every season around this time of the year managers start to grow bored with their drafted players and the siren’s call of rookie nookie starts to take hold. As injuries and ineptitude begin to set in and pitchers go on the Disabled and Disgraced Lists, the buzz surrounding pitching prospects can overwhelm one’s better reasoning. I’m not going to harsh your mellow and tell you not to take a flier on a young pitcher, I just ask that you understand what you’re most likely going to get. Chances are a prospect will give you solid 4th or 5th starter numbers. Don’t overpay for a name. A lot of commenters have been asking about trading for names like Hanson and Price; generally, these trades are grossly overvaluing young arms.

I can already hear some of you: “P0rk, you’re an idiot.” Plenty of people may agree with you but I come bearing numbers. Argue with these, jerk:

Clayton Kershaw: the buzz about Kershaw prior to his call up last season had many managers saving their waiver priority in order to land a stud. Instead they got a roofie with a 5-5 record, 4.26 ERA, and 1.50 WHIP. At least he was nice enough to give you 100 Ks in 107.2 innings. Don’t be rude, thank the man.

Max Scherzer: Jobacum was overshadowed by Kershaw in a lot of places, but not here at Razzball. I’ll share a secret with you even though you called me an idiot: Grey knows what he’s talking about. Over 56 innings last season Scherzer posted a 3.05 ERA, 1.23 WHIP, and 66 Ks with only 22 BB. If he played for a team that provided run support he would have had a record better than 0-4. Scherzer is one of the few exceptions but his lack of playing time still limited his value.

Johnny Cueto: he failed to live up to the hype, pitching more like Kuato than the Cueto people expected. In 31 starts he had a 4.81 ERA, 1.41 WHIP, and went 9-14. Go ahead Mr. Glass-is-half-full, tell me about his 158 Ks in 174 IP. Now that you’re done living in the past there is good news; his K/9 this season matches last year’s while his ERA and WHIP are a respectable 2.55 and 1.19. Two games is a small sample size but you did read Grey’s recommendation, right? He was even nice enough to repeat himself for the slow kids.

Edinson Volquez: last season Volquez made a lot of Cueto owners think they grabbed the wrong Red. I hope you enjoyed it because his career numbers show he’s probably an above 4.00 ERA pitcher. Unlike Scherzer, he had enough playing time to be an actual exception to the rule. Which is why I’m pleading a technicality and saying his 80 innings from 2005 to 2007 disqualify him from this discussion. You’ll need bigger guns than that to prove me wrong, chump.

Tim Lincecum: There’s no denying Tiny Tim is a great pitcher, but when he first hit the big leagues in 2007 the big leagues hit back. Over 24 starts he had a 4.00 ERA, 1.28 WHIP, and went 7-5. The 150 Ks in 146.1 innings did let the world know he came to bring the pain.

Joba Chamberlain: If you ignore his 24 innings in 2007 (don’t argue that I can’t do that since I used Volquez’s 80 innings against him, I’m writing this so what I say goes), Joba was worth the hype in 2008. In 42 games,12 starts, and 100.1 innings he had a 2.60 ERA, 1.26 WHIP, and 118 Ks and had some people drawing comparisons to Papelbon. His move to the rotation and the Yankee Jet-stream has his bad numbers up this season and his good numbers like K/9 down. Joba owners are hoping its nothing a stiff drink couldn’t fix. What, too soon?

Yovani Gallardo: Yo’s 2007 numbers were respectable, and by respectable I mean 3.67 ERA, 1.27 WHIP, and 101 Ks in 110.1 innings. Unlike his frustrating teammate Parra he showed control in issuing just 37 free passes. How respectable is that? Respectable enough to finish 9-5 in 17 starts.

Chad Billingsley: The people demand more Bills and I’m never one to leave you hanging. In 2006 C.Bills went 7-4 but didn’t show the league what really made him special. Over 18 games and 16 starts (90 innings for those of you keeping score at home) he notched a 3.80 ERA and1.67 WHIP but just 59 Ks to 58 BB. Compare his 2006 K:BB to ’07 (141:64) and ’08 (201:80) and it should be no surprise that some are whispering Cy Young this season. Now that I gave you more Bills where are the mittens I asked for? My quid is missing your quo.

Johan Santana: While Johan may have competition for the title of best pitcher in the game these days, nobody will argue he’s been one of the most dominant pitchers of the modern era. Except maybe this guy.  Johan is perhaps the best evidence that no matter how talented a pitcher is, their first season may not be a good representation of their skills. In 2000 Johan had a 6.94 ERA, 1.81 WHIP, and just 64 Ks in 86 IP. His career numbers of 3.08 ERA, 1.10 WHIP, and 9.3 K/9 show just how dominant he became after 2000.

Some of these players did have numbers justifying the hype, but the danger in chasing buzz is it is too easy to get suckered into playing the weepstakes. If you dropped Aaron Cook for Kershaw or Cueto you gave up a 3.96 ERA and 16 wins for Kershaw’s 4.26 and 5 or Cueto’s 4.81 and 9. That’s not exactly a bargain. Even the likes of Andy Sonnanstine (4.38 and 13 Wins) and Jorge Campillo (3.91 and 8 Wins) had numbers falling within the range shown above. Do Sonnanstine and Campillo excite you? Say no even if the answer is yes. You should take a chance on a player like Hanson or Holland, just don’t give up too much for him. And if you happen to own Hanson now would be a great time to try to sell him to a manager that’s fallen into the hype trap.

  1. BigFatHippo says:
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    Damnit p0rk, I dealt Zimm last night, now how am I gonna ever deal Hanson. You’re giving away my secrets, good job but I would have sold them to you.

    Also, you can’t put an 8 and a ) together, it ends up like this 8)

  2. p0rk burn says:
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    @BigFatHippo: Hah I was wondering where the Effing bacon that emoticon came from. I knew it wasn’t Grey’s style to sprinkle them in there.

    I was actually thinking about adding a section about Zimmerman but things happened before I got a chance. Maybe in the future there will be a director’s cut.

  3. Griff says:
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    Good points in this article. I think your sample is even being too kind to young pitchers. I’m thinking of guys like Homer Bailey, Phil Hughes, Gio Gonzalez, Clay Buccholz, etc. Prospects can be downright cringe-inducing.

  4. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    yes im guilty,man crush on young hyped sp`s,i think it comes from only being in a keeper league with 6 bench and 2 dl slots,now i have zimm,hanson and holland in a 12 team 5×5,ive already held this long so might as well stick it out unless offered some value

  5. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @BigFatHippo: hippo i already typed you a congradulatory commenet in the drew a blank post,for your 1st place standing in original division

  6. Eric C. says:
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    Does anyone have thoughts on Hughes’ chances this season?

  7. p0rk burn says:
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    @Griff: I considered adding Homer and even did the research on Hughes, but I thought people would accuse me of cherry picking stats to justify my position. I’m still pretty sure people will come up with a thousand more pitchers that prove me wrong. I’m glad you think I was too easy on the prospects.

  8. @ PB: Are you with Grey on Liriano as a Buy Low? Might he be an exception to your argument, and will his performance going forward justify the hype associated with his name? Or will dealing for him result in 4th Starter production?

  9. BigFatHippo says:
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    @AL KOHOLIC: Too early for me to get excited enough to hunch someone’s leg over it. But thanks.

  10. jsp2014 says:
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    I have such a hard-on for young pitchers, so it was a pretty big buzzkill to see you’re arguing against them.

    Kershaw was much better the 2nd time he was called up last year. Even including his first attempt, he’s at about 9 k/9 for his career and 46% GB%. 4.5 bb/9 should be tolerable given those numbers. He pitches in a good park with a great offense and bullpen in a terrible hitting division, so he really has a great set-up. I think it’d be a mistake not to try to pry him away from his owner right now.

    I’d take Lincecum’s rookie numbers any day. Those are 146 innings that any team with an innings cap could benefit from.

    I think my main argument for young pitchers is that typically they carry a high K/9. That really limits the damage they can do, and pads their upside. Of all 10 standard roto categories, K’s might be the easiest to project, so it’s a category I always try to be strong in. They may often be mediocre otherwise, but they’re either cheap in the draft (I got Kershaw around the 17th in leagues) or freely available on waivers. If

    Sure, Cook won 16 games with a nice ERA, but that’s the absolute best case scenario, and his fantasy value was still dragged down by his terrible K-rate. The downside is sticking with a guy like Bronson Arroyo. I’d much prefer a guy like Hanson who can more than likely get me 8+ K/9 and be otherwise decent, with the small possibility that he ends up being a difference-maker in my season.

  11. Pops says:
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    I own both Hughes and J – Zimm. Of the two, I could see myself dealing Hughes after a couple of hot starts. As for J – Zimm, I’m hoping that he’s the exception to the rule this year.

  12. Freak says:
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    Rudy, you promised you would post FRL standings yesterday.

    I feel let down.

  13. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    I spent way to much last year to purchase Mad Max. I have a tendency to fall for the hype as well. I know that he put up better stats last year then shown by his record, but the fact is that he still has not won a game in the Bigs. His last start was one of his worse. I don’t think that he has gone beyond 5 innings in his short career. Hopefully, he will come around, as I have him in several leagues. As a general comment, many of us are attracted to the new and flashy. I think that it is part of the maturing process in fantasy competition to be able to control this passion with objectivity. I confess that I am not there yet.

    @Eric C – Hughes certainly has the talent, but there is always the question of whether he can compete in the Big Apple. Many pitchers who later have been productive in podunk ML cities have succumbed to the pressure of NY. The media focus is unbelievable.

  14. IowaCubs

    IowaCubs says:
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    p0rk burn is the Professor Emeritus of Razzball.

    I also love that when I write “Razzball” on the screen now, my computer doesn’t recognize it as a misspelling.

  15. IowaCubs

    IowaCubs says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: You have the distinction of having the best Razzball handle.

  16. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @Rudy Gamble: hey rudy,what day is it you update the master standings?tuesday?thanks looking forward to a possible climb inside the top 40,baby steps

  17. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @IowaCubs – Thanks – comes from a family/friends fantasy league where all of us have handles that are Soprano spin-offs. I do come from New Jousy, ya know. However, I would be a lot happier if my fantasy expertise was equivelant to the imaginative qualities of my handle. Which leads me to…

    @AL KOHOLIC – I would like to delay the posting as long as possible, or at least until I can reach a respectable position. But I did feel a lot better when I read that our estimable Baron Vulturewins also admitted that he was in 9th place, which boosted my self esteem by several degrees. . At least I think that it was him. If not, I humbly apologize.

  18. p0rk burn says:
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    @zombie: I don’t think Liriano will ever recapture the magic. He’ll be serviceable down the road (pervert) but I don’t think he’ll be as good as he was his first season. Think Marcum’s season last year, but at the start “once upon a time” style.

    @jsp2014: Timmy from UW definitely put up high Ks and showed he was going to be somebody. I wholly agree that high k/9s are worthwhile, but that may be symptomatic. Once batters adjust those same arms may fall off in terms of K/9 while their ERA and WHIP go up. And for the record, I’m not a Kershaw fan this season or last.

  19. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: your team is well rounded head to toe,no matter how good any of our teams look on paper it takes some good fortune to win these things,barring bad luck and major injuries ,youll be in the mix,i just hope i am also,Good luck,nice having you in my the same league though,your one of the few that are active in the post and can take and give a little shit razzing

  20. BigFatHippo says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: Baron must have been referring to the Razzball league where you assemble the worst possible team. He opted out of our league this year.

    I second Iowa’s opinion, nice handle, called my boss that the other day. <======= I would not recommend this, btw!

  21. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @IowaCubs – As a matter of fact, the thought came to me that there should be some special notice of the Commenter who finishes dead last in the standings. (This would not include those who abandoned their team.) This individual would have displayed a great deal of grit and forbearance, as well as the ability to stand up to ridicule, in order to withstand the rigors of fielding an abysmal team week after grueling week. Perhaps he/she can do a special column, for who would know better what not to do to if you wish to achieve success, and how to develop the knack of morphing a Commenter Team into a Razzballer Team. Perhaps the imaginative Commenters out their can think of a special title for this ignominous honor.

  22. p0rk burn says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: Coming from Alaska I can speak to a similar award. The last person to finish the Iditaron wins the Red Lantern award and is respected and given almost as much adulation as the winner.

  23. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @AL KOHOLIC – I certainly enjoy your presence in the league as well. i love throwing and receiving shizz razzing, as long as it doesn’t devolve into name calling. I am in one of those leagues this year, unfortunately, and what is worse is that it is a Keeper League, and I will have to associate with these individuals over the long term.

    I think that my problem is not so much in evaluating players, for I, like many of us hear, am hopelessly addicted to fantasy sports, especially baseball, and read everything I can get my hands on. Rather, I have a tendency to panic when my team is not doing well, and then make precipitous rules which create a negative momentum. I had set a 24 hour rule – not to make any decisions to cut a player until I could get over being thoroughly P.O’ed at the player’s ineptitude, which I completely illogically believe is directed at me. I also have this wierd belief that my fantasy team is an epistemological entity, having a type of life as an extension of myself. Now, this sounds completely crazy, and perhaps I should consume some thorazine immediately, but why then do teams seem to gather momentum as a whole, or plummet in the same manner? I find this one of the most intriguing things about fantasy. Last year, one of my teams in H2H was mediocre throughout the year, barely made the playoffs but for no reason in particular reason caught on fire collectively and won three straight playoff matches.

    Cust Kayin

  24. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @p0rk burn – Exactly! I had a good friend back in my High School days who was on the Cross Country team for 4 years. Every year he was dead last in every race, but never quit. I admired him a great deal more then the jocks who received all of the adulation; although to be honest, there is not much adulation in Cross Country running. Anyone who finishes the Iditerod is, by definition, a special individual. But to finish it when trailing the field is, in it’s own way, a glorious achievement in perseverance.

  25. IowaCubs

    IowaCubs says:
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    Am I crazy for not wanting to start Danks tonight? He’s never pitched well against the Mariners.

  26. Griff says:
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    This argument can probably be tackled empirically. Maybe Rudy can put his math skills to use and tell us whether the high K/9 of rookie pitchers earns point share, or whether they just roofie our ratios. Anecdotally, it also seems to me that rookie pitchers win fewer games: they don’t go as deep into games and they don’t pitch out of jams consistently. How many times do you see a youngster give up a couple of singles and then start trying to throw 114 mph down the middle?

  27. I'm Keith Hernandez says:
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    I. Offered peavy and Davis for David Wright. Is peavy and Davis too much for Evan? I have too much starting pitching.

  28. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: paulie,you ever seen mickey blue eyes,comedy mob movie?funnny,listen to him trying to talk mob lango,fa get about it

  29. I'm Keith Hernandez says:
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    @I’m Keith Hernandez: the Wright owners counter was beyond ridiculous. Is this a good trade for Evan?

  30. Pops says:
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    @I’m Keith Hernandez: I’d give it a shot. Sell Peavy while he still has that shiny household name.

  31. I'm Keith Hernandez says:
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    @Pops: are you saying do that trade for Evan? I think the owner would accept.

  32. jerkstore says:
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    I have Peavy, Hamels and Harden. Who should I sell?

  33. BigFatHippo says:
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    @jerkstore: Sell Harden, you can get more for him after yesterdays win.

  34. Steve says:
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    Lind @ Bannister, Ibanez v Martis.

    Who sits, who starts?

  35. Cory says:
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    Jered Weaver had a really good start if memory serves me

  36. Griff says:
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    Inge just crushed two balls barely foul off of Sabathia (one off the wall, one about 10 rows deep in the outfield), then took the 0-2 pitch back up the middle for a base hit. I’m starting to buy a comeback season for him.

  37. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @Rudy Gamble: hanley hit on wrist left game,no other info yet

  38. Doc says:
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    Napoli is chapping my hide. Should I drop him for a Suzuki/Flores/Baker type?

  39. BigFatHippo says:
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    @Griff: And Catcher eligible, I bought a long time ago ;)

  40. Joe D says:
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    Should I take Kinsler for Mike Young and Brandon Phillips? Its been offered to me and JJ Hardy is a free agent so I could use him to fill the SS slot

  41. @p0rk burn: Awesome post. I feel like just the other day I was hoping someone would do this. And here it is! Thanks, RazzMindReaderGenie!

    The only two young pitchers I can remember coming up in the last five years and being totally unhittable were Liriano and Jered Weaver in ’06. I think that pair greatly perverted what people expect young pitchers can do out of the gate.

    @jsp2014: But the truth is, you can get 80 IP of 9+ K/9 from the right middle relievers, and you’ll get fantastic ratios to boot. Though it is profoundly less sexy than jumping on Tommy Hanson.

    @Paulie Allnuts: I was in 9th in my so-called regular league — i.e. the league I play in with pals of varying degrees of obsessiveness.

    I am happy to report that, since that day, my Fighting Fanta Pants have vaulted to 4th, thanks largely to Prince Fielder and Jay Bruce both coming out of their comas.
    @I’m Keith Hernandez: Peavy/Davis for Evan Longoria? That’s fair — but ask for a pitcher back.

  42. Joe D says:
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    @doc: Napoli’s not getting enough bats to be productive, take suzuki… he’ll give you decent numbers with a good average and without striking out

  43. IowaCubs

    IowaCubs says:
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    I just traded Cliff Lee for Aaron Hill. In the aforementioned post comments, I mentioned how I was in the middle of a Slowey/Andrus swap. He countered with Lee and I accepted before he could change his mind.

    Please tell me that this wasn’t wreckless.

  44. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    Two dingers for Zimmerman. Could this be the break-out year I have patiently been waiting for?

    Any news on HanRam?

  45. I read on rotoworld forums that the Mets broadcast said xrays negative, day to day.

    Should I trade Ricky Nolasco for Jon Lester?

  46. Colin says:
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    Thank you Anibal Sanchez. Giving up a Grand Slam to a loser always does wonders for my team ERA.

  47. @IowaCubs: Much better. Slowey outpitches Lee this year by a good stretch. BELIEVE IT.

    @Paulie Allnuts: What’s your definition of “break out”? If it’s .280/27/100, then yes, this could be it. If it’s .320/35/120, then how does .280/27/100 sound to you?

    Zim’s good value, if a) he stays healthy and b) you didn’t draft him in round 5.

    @Maitland: Both are risky pitchers. If that means nothing to you, go search “risky pitchers” in the searchy box.

    Lester = more wins; Nolasco = more everything else, assuming they both stay healthy. Which isn’t all that likely, sadly.

  48. Yeah, I have seen the risky pitchers stuff, was kind of looking for some opinions on them aside from that. I didn’t really like the risky pitchers analysis, but didn’t want to dwell on that or bring it up, just because I love most of what I read on the site otherwise .

  49. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    thats my boy,howard finding his stroke,well 1-4 is his stroke but if the 1 is a hr then ill take it

  50. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @BigFatHippo: what an arm on molina,picked of escobar and he wasnt off 1st very far,

  51. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Maitland: I’d prefer Nolasco to Lester.

  52. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Maitland: Oh, and thanks for the update on Hanley.

  53. @Maitland: Well, what would be the impetus to make that trade? It’s kind of apples-to-apples, as the esteemed Grey would say, unless you have strong feelings that one of those pitchers is due for a big leap forward, while the other might regress…

    All things being equal, and both pitchers healthy, I want Lester there, because I think his Ws are pretty much guaranteed, while Nolasco could scuffle and win 11 games.

  54. Joe D says:
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    Should I take Kinsler for Mike Young and Brandon Phillips? Its been offered to me and JJ Hardy is a free agent so I could use him to fill the SS void

  55. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Joe D: I’d want Hardy and Kinsler.

  56. BigFatHippo says:
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    @AL KOHOLIC: I love Yadi, he’s the best catcher in baseball.

  57. @Baron Von Vulturewins: Well, I guess it just comes down to wanting to kind of gauge if other people have strong feelings that one of those pitchers might be due for a big leap forward. I think a lot of pitching value comes in actually watching them pitch. I haven’t seen either of them and both I felt would get better coming into the year, but that hasn’t been the case.

  58. Dom says:
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    I was just offered Jose Reyes (last year of contract) for Chad Billingslee and Fuentez (both low salary for 2 years) 5 x 5 10 team league, I’m already leading in SB, thoughts?

  59. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Dom: It sounds like you don’t need Reyes, so the question is can you flip him for something else?

  60. Steve says:
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    @Grey: Try and flip Cueto for Al-Ram?

    10-team keeper.

  61. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Steve: I like Cueto to continue to be solid and Al-Ram to bounce back. Depends on needs, but I do want Al-Ram a bit more, only I’d hate to sell Cueto too.

  62. BabyBeluga says:
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    McCann on the DL – picked up Ross (so far so good).
    Should I use my number 1 priority to pick up Ramon Hernandez? (recently dropped) – 12 team, 2 catcher (have Soto and now Ross).
    -yahoo league, so many of the likely call ups are already available – with McCann’s injury an unknown at this time, should I take a chance on Ramon or hold with Ross?

  63. Steve says:
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    @Grey: Harang maybe?

  64. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @BabyBeluga: Just hold Ross for now.

    @Steve: I’d prefer to trade Cueto for Al-Ram.

  65. Steve says:
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    @Grey: Sorry – you’re answering in a vacuum. Should have given more context.

    I have KJ at 2nd and Cano at MI. Looking to upgrade 2nd, obviously.

    Rest of my staff is Peavy, Cain, Beckett, Jobacum, Harang, Wolf, Cueto with Erv Santana on the DL.

    Reckon I can probably afford to give him up – or should I offer Scherzer?

  66. Billy says:
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    Rodney is cracking!!!

  67. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Steve: Yeah, that helps. I’d give Cueto for Al-Ram there.

    @Billy: Phew, almost blew it.

  68. BSA says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts:
    Negative Momentum = When the whole league advances while your team gets sucked backwards by the vacuum created. Note – I am in last and keep plummeting. I can’t buy a hit unless it is against one of my pitchers. Homeruns are on strike, can’t get a wiff.

    Stoopid = Coming back tomorrow thinking it has to change.

    @Paulie Allnuts:
    Its kind of hard to write about what I don’t understand – i.e.: How to turn a fantasy team drafted with good intentions into a Razzball competitor.

    I think the writer, I mean I, should get some time to mourn if that happens.

  69. BKK says:
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    @p0rk burn: Nice post P0rk. I still agree with you on Kershaw.
    @AL KOHOLIC: Don’t get too comfortable in 4th. I’m gunning for ya!
    @Paulie Allnuts: @Paulie Allnuts: You and Al should get a room. By the way, eat my dust. You interested in Peralta, now that Hanley is headed for the DL?@jsp2014: Thanks for the research you did on players headed for corrections based on unsustainable stats in Grey’s post. Really good stuff.
    @Grey: Have to make our own decisions at times. Went against the grain and started Verlander. I decided I was going to start my risky bunch of pitchers and start everyone everyday good or bad for the month of April and live with the results. I was rewarded nicely. 9k’s, 0ER’s, 1.0 WHIP and a W.

  70. RT says:
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    Anybody watching the Rox game tonight? Fowler has 3 SB.

  71. Eric W says:
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    Fowler is running all over Tally 4 steals in 3 innings.

  72. Dexter says:
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    I have Upton and Fowler is sitting as a FA. Worth it to try to trade Upton and pick up Fowler to replace him?

  73. BKK says:
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    FOWLER!!!! 4 SB’s!!!!!!

  74. RT says:
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    serious man love for Fowler

  75. Billy says:
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    NYY are in trouble they lose to Verlander, how bad is that…

  76. BigFatHippo says:
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    @BSA: “Stoopid = Coming back tomorrow thinking it has to change.”

    Same as ex-girlfriends, they’re like spoiled milk. Did you ever take a carton outta the fridge, take a gulp, gag, then put it back in thinking it would be better tomorrow?

    No! It’s fuckin spoiled………..

  77. BigFatHippo says:
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    Ryan Franklin is filthy, been telling you all to get him. Did anybody listen? Knock, knock, hope you did…………

  78. BKK says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: He singled in the first. Stole 2nd, then he an spils ran a double steal of 3rd and 2nd. In the third, he walked, stole 2nd and then stole 3rd.

  79. @BKK: You’re right! Yahoo! is just slow.

    You know who isn’t slow? THE BARON.

    Toodle-o, Justin Upside! Welcome back, Dexter “The Serial Stealer” Fowler!

  80. BigFatHippo says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: Ha! The Cereal Stealer, that’s my little brother.

    Yahoo is about 5 min behind ESPN.

  81. BKK says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: I was sitting at 11 steals for the month. He singled handedly gave a near 50% boost. Add in 1 from Sizemore and presto, BKK moves from last to 6th in steals. Can you hear my footsteps @AL KOHOLIC: .

  82. BKK says:
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    @BKK: Good thing cause the rest of your team isn’t hitting for shizz!!

  83. RT says:
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    and hell.. let stewy steal one for good measure.

  84. @BigFatHippo: Thankfully RazzWatch is right on time.

    Dang, that 4 steals would have looked good in my lineup tonight. And unlike Bonifuhggedabouhim, Fowler is very much for reals.

    Fowler: Hitting lead-off, batting .300, swiping bags with impunity. I think Vernon Wells is going to spend a lot of time on the pine this week…

  85. BKK says:
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    @BKK: And your closers ruined a good start by Verlander. UUUgh Hanrahan and Cordero!! Fantasy baseball is so cruel!

  86. RT says:
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    FIVE!!!!!!!!

    You are kidding me.

  87. Colin says:
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    Someone please tell me why Hanrahan is such a dumbass? Look at me I’m Joel, I’m going to throw a straight fastball down and in to a left handed power hitter. Hehehehhe.

    JACKASS.

  88. BigFatHippo says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: I like Nyjer Morgan too, playing every day, Pirates hittin OK, he’s a must play. <======== (Channeling my inner Dr Suess)

  89. BKK says:
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    @Colin: First pitch, right in his wheel house!

    Fowler rules!

  90. BKK says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: @BigFatHippo: I am willing to admit when I am wrong. This discussion we had a few weeks back.

    Nyjer >>>>> Gardner.

    I yield to your greatness.

  91. RT says:
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    @BKK:
    It’s like watching a video game.

  92. BigFatHippo says:
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    I’m about ready to hunch Raul Ibanez leg right now!

  93. Steve says:
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    @BigFatHippo: He Sonavabenched me in my H2H league…

  94. Grey

    Grey says:
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    Fowler!

  95. Eric W says:
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    I would be so much more excited about having fowler if i didint start chris young tonight.

  96. Colin says:
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    Thank god I put Fowler in tonight…I almost sat him for the hot Upton. Then I realized my grandmother could steal of Young with those long ass legs. Glad I did. I expected 1 or 2 but 5? Wow!

  97. @Colin: Ha! I don’t even know what happened (yet) but my Hanrahan owner in my league just dumped his save-blowing ass. So I assume the news is not good.

  98. @BKK: Gardner is caca-doo-doo.

    @Grey: I wonder if you’re just now checking in, or if it takes 5 steals to prompt a reaction.

    Before you were like, “4 steals. Sure. WHATEVER.”

  99. RT says:
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    I’m surprised no one has mentioned Kemp batting clean up tonight

  100. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: Just returned from dinner. Wow, I needed that 5 steals badly. Fowler!

    @RT: Kemp’s batting cleanup.

  101. BigFatHippo says:
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    @Steve: Nooooo, you didn’t, ouch. Never bench a sure thing, he’s a hitta dude………

  102. BKK says:
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    @RT: The amazing thing is he has swiped 5 bases and its only mid 5th and he’s due up 2nd. Apparently, he thinks he is Ricky Henderson. The record is 6 in AL; 1912 and 7 in NL; 1881 and 1894. Would be really cool if he could match either of those.

  103. Steve says:
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    @BigFatHippo: I have Lind too. Stupid LF slot.

  104. Grey

    Grey says:
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    Run Rusch run!

  105. RT says:
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    @BKK:
    I was almost disappointed when he walked.

    @Grey:
    Zing!

  106. BKK says:
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    @Baron Von Vulturewins: Re: Gardner..so you said…Hanrahan ERA 81.00, WHIP 9.00, yields a GS to Ibanez, 1st pitch right where he likes it, low and inside. IDIOT.

  107. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @BKK – FIVE STEALS! HanRam and Ichiro have a total of four steals for the entire SEASON. Otherwise, you tell me how a team with both of the above is LAST in STEALS!

    The fantasy gods have deserted me. They demand a brutal penance – read the entire archives of the Great Mr. Roto.

    However I don’t think that Hanley will have to do time on the DL. All in all, I should have chosen Puhols.

  108. Steve says:
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    @Grey: What’s you’re thinking on Wolf? If you can’t do your thing in that division, where can you?

  109. BKK says:
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    @RT: ya, he ain’t going anywhere with Rusch in front of him.

  110. RT says:
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    @BKK:
    would it be greedy if I said a donk would be the cherry on the sundae?

  111. RT says:
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    From Rotoworld:
    Troy Tulowitzki was benched Monday and may not see playing time during the foreseeable future.
    Tulowitzki is going back to the drawing board with the coaching staff. They will all work to help the shortstop break out of a season-long slump that has him batting .167 through 17 games. The team still has high hopes for its first round pick in 2005, which is why they’ll take their time to work with him – meaning he won’t return to the lineup until they feel he’s ready. He shouldn’t be on your fantasy squad anyway, but if he is, now is the time to drop him

  112. BKK says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: I can’t figure that either. You and I were wallowing in last for saves and I have Sizemore, Weeks and Hart. The problem is you have to get on base to steal one. Suzuki is your knew power guy, didn’t you get the memo…steals is so passe…he now hits HR’s.

  113. Steve says:
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    Haren had clearly decided that no schmohawk is going to give him run support so he might as well do it himself.

  114. BKK says:
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    @RT: Is that donk or doink? Has the RAZZ nation decided? And yes, that would be too greedy, but hey, as Rockefeller once answered to the question “How much is enough?” …”Just a little more!”.

  115. SP says:
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    Dexter Fowler Owners Circle Jerk!!!

  116. BigFatHippo says:
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    Pena hits #9 on his way to 50, ho-hum, just another day at the office………………hey, what’d Dexter Fowler do?

  117. BigFatHippo says:
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    @BKK: I like Donk, Baron’s term.

  118. BKK says:
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    @BigFatHippo: I own him too!! If my closers weren’t such Shizz. I’da had an unbelievable night

  119. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @BKK – I think you mean Steals. Yeah, Ichiro has as many dingers as Mags. HamRam is batting 3rd, and has some back pain, (and now wrist pain on top of it), icing himself up after every game. And he has been caught stealing 3 X’s. I am so desparate that I picked up two SAGNOF’s temporarily – Bourn and Bonafacio. My BA keeps plummeting, and I am last in runs scored. But as Yogi used to say, “They ain’t in a slump; they’re just not hittin’.

  120. BigFatHippo says:
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    @BKK: You still had an unbelievable night.

    Closers only pitch one inning or so, if they get shelled it doesn’t hurt your ratios that much, keep the faith.

  121. Freak says:
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    Way too many comments to keep track of.

    I give up.

  122. Doc says:
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    Hawpe hit in the neck and leaves on a stretcher

  123. BKK says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: I did it again. I wish they could get saves, would probably do better than my lot.

    I saw you picked up Bourn and and Bonerfellatio. I was looking at Bourn. Didn’t realize Spills was out there or I would have tried to make room for him. I wish ESPN had a “watch list”.

  124. Zebo says:
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    Fowler got picked up right before I tried to, who has better season, Dexter or Justin Upton?

  125. Eric W says:
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    @Freak: you blow up that house on extreme makeover yet?

  126. BKK says:
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    @BigFatHippo: Ya, Cordero ERA 18, Hanrahan ERA 81, and my team ERA actually improved! Thanks to Verlander and Jar-Jar. When things are going well, its hard not to get greedy.

    @Freak: It’s all just mindless banter anyway…at least my part.

  127. yoshinorimike says:
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    question for anyone! (grey, etc.)

    hopelessly contextless but, worth dropping Lind for Fowler?

    ok here’s some context, on a team that has decent power already and some avg. deficiencies (think Sizemore, Howard, Cruz, Kinsler, C. Quentin)

  128. Doc says:
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    If I pick up Wakefield he’ll give up 3 doinks and 4 donks in his next start.

  129. AL KOHOLIC says:
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    @BKK: yeah i miss the watch list to,but damn yahoo`s box scores are so so,it would take them an hour and a half to watch 60 minutes

  130. BKK says:
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    @AL KOHOLIC: Yahoo is slow, always about an inning behind. And we have to pay for that service? A couple tweaks to ESPN and it would be much nicer than Yahoo. Took me a while to get used to, but really starting to like some aspects of it.

  131. yoshinorimike says:
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    @BKK: total ditto; first year on info-overload espn for me but already I’m sure I’d never go back to yahoo in its current state, cleaner interface or not.

  132. Freak says:
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    @Eric W: No blowing up, this time. But everything’s all been built.

  133. Zebo says:
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    correct me if I am wrong, but how did Hanrahan get charged with 7 ER? The phillies scored all of 6 runs in that inning, and Hanrahan didn’t even come in until the last 4 runs. What’s going on?

  134. mgeoffriau

    Mark says:
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    Yahoo’s box score is wrong. It shows more ER than R for both Mock and Hanrahan. And the Col-SD game is now 2 innings behind the action.

    Frustrating.

  135. @Griff: We can look to last year to see the proof. http://razzball.com/2008-draft-rankings/2008-player-rater-12-team/

    Cueto ranked #365 and Parra ranked #371. Their K value was 0.4 and 0.1 vs. the average pitcher but their ERA and WHIPs were toxic. (both at around -5.5 points vs. the average pitcher).

    Volquez, incidentally was #52.

    The biggest issue with those young pitchers – assuming they have good K rates – are poor control (see Parra) or they give up a lot of HRs (see Cueto). The lower the BB rate, the more comfortable I feel. But I prefer 2nd year pitchers than rookies….

  136. mgeoffriau

    Mark says:
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    So, who’s grabbing Kip Wells? Should I drop Chris Duncan for him?

  137. nick m. says:
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    With the news that Tulo may sit for a bit, should i pick up K. Greene or Guzman coming of DL, Barmes, or Andrus? Drop Tulo himself for one of these guys, or sit on him and drop Ian Stewart or Glen Perkins?

  138. Paulie Allnuts

    Paulie Allnuts says:
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    @Mark – The Yahoo box score is also incorrect for Kerry Wood. It has him listed having an ERA of 81.00. In actuality, it was 40.5, which is bad enough.

    @ BKK – Agree with you completely concerning Yahoo vs ESPN. Stattracker often gets stuck in time, especially if you have more then one team. And yes, ESPN is free. But like yourself, the one thing that I miss is the waiting list. Watched some of Bonafellatio tonight – he swings wildly at everything. I will probably give him a week or so to get his act together, but if he hits .100 with no steals, sayanora.

    @Pork Burn – BTW, great column

  139. Steve says:
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    @Paulie Allnuts: They seem to be double counting quite a few stats. F-Cord apparently gave up 3 runs, 5 of them earned…

  140. Steve says:
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    C’mon the Dodgers – let’s get a win for the Wolfman!

    Rrrrroooooowwwww!

    Sorry.

  141. cubbies299 says:
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    FML, hawpe to the DL and Tulo to the bench? What a shitty night. And I benched Verlander’s gem.

  142. Colin says:
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    Anyone know why Julian Tavarez isn’t being considered for the closer’s role in WAS? He’s the only RP with decent stats. I think he has 12 k’s in 8 IP.

  143. yoshinorimike says:
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    @Grey: thanks. for the same team, drop AHill or Weeks for Fowler (filling util slot)?

  144. Griff says:
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    @Rudy Gamble: Very interesting, thanks for pointing it out. I think you have the strategy correct: wait the young guys out during their rookie year.

  145. Nick says:
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    @Grey: Just checkin my waiver wire out and there are a few people on their that be worth a claim…although it is 10team league

    On offense I don’t know about the A Ramirez situation but Lowell is a free agent… C Young & Aviles were dropped early on in the season but don’t think I need either position as my outfield is stocked and SS 2B is Reyes & Utley

    Pitchers available include J Weaver, Verlander, Harang, Millwood, Duke…but my starters are Beckett, Bills, Peavy, Bedard, Wainwright & Slowey. & I can’t drop any offense as none are worth being on the wire for.

  146. Zebo says:
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    Is Dexter more than SAGNOF? Dexter or Justin Upton for the season?

  147. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Colin: Might be in line, anything’s possible there.

    @yoshinorimike: Nah

    @Nick: Don’t think there’s anything to do there right now.

    @Zebo: Dexter’s more SAGNOF, yeah.

  148. Steve says:
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    @Grey: If I picked up Fowler, I’d have to bench either Votto or Morneau as i have Beltran in my CF spot.

    No point is there?

  149. G says:
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    Should I try Garza and Bonaficio for Mark Teixeira. The guy is in last place and might be willing to do it. Is it fair and whats the chances of this happening. Will Teixeira return to his regular form soon?

  150. Steve says:
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    @Grey: Also, who’s most expendable to grab a Hawpe fill-in – Holland, Saito or Zumaya?

  151. Zebo says:
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    @Grey: did you mean Dexter is more than just SAGNOF, or he’s got more than SAGNOF, your post sounded ambiguous, lol. I missed Dexter, but I can still get Justin. Is this the year J-Up puts it all together and becomes ROY? I recall you said his upside is superstar, but I was checking his minor league stats, they were not screaming “superstar” to me.

  152. Nick says:
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    @Grey: Thought so just checkin….I’m workin on Abreu or Hunter for Shields but the team he is on is stacked with hitters so I don’t think he wants offense. Any other pitchers extremely similar to him…which is around a 97 O-rank and a 250’s season rank but is definitely going to come around (like Shields). The only reason I mention rankings is because I’m playing with a couple amateurs who will trade based on #’s alone….really frustrates me!

  153. yoshinorimike says:
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    @G: that is a straight up steal for you; if I was in your league I’d veto it in a second.

  154. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Steve: Nope — Holland

    @G: I want Tex

    @Zebo: He’s a tremendous talent, and it could be this year, but it hasn’t seemed it yet.

  155. Drev says:
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    @Grey: Beckett or Peavy for the rest of the year and why?

  156. JR says:
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    The proper use of “doink” is all by itself: Pena hit another one today. Doink!

    But use “donk” as the noun: Pena hit another donk tonight.

    Baron would probably even use “donk” as a verb: Chris Davis donks. That’s what he does.

  157. Infamous says:
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    What would be a fair trade offer for Dan Haren or Joba??

  158. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Drev: Peavy, cuz.

    @Infamous: Depends what you need and they are in two totally different classes. Haren’s a top starter. Joba’s a 2nd to 3rd starter with upside and downside.

  159. Infamous says:
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    @Grey: I’m lacking on K’s, Wins, and ERA. I could start with a Russel martin since I have Chris Ianneta and Wieters on my bench. Any suggestions?

  160. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Infamous: Be great if you can pull off Haren for Martin, but don’t think it’s gonna work. Martin for Joba isn’t a great trade. You should get someone a little more reliable. Think Wainwright, Shields, etc.

  161. Infamous says:
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    Would a Russel Martin and Magglio for Haren be giving up too much?

  162. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Infamous: Yeah, a bit. It’s not awful though. Maybe Martin and a 2nd rate closer — like Valverde or Capps.

  163. Colin says:
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    So fellas…what do we do with Joel Hanrahan? God it’s sickening watching this guy struggle with his command and then when he does throw a strike, it’s hit over the wall.

  164. Infamous says:
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    @Grey: So how would you rate position players against pitchers, as you can tell im new at this. Thats why I am having trouble trying to come up with a trade. I’m not sure about how they compare.

  165. Infamous says:
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    @Colin: I feel your pain buddy.

  166. Colin says:
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    @Infamous: Inf are you keeping him? I’m thinking of stashing him and picking up Tavarez… I don’t see any other option but to send him down. The kid’s confidence HAS to be shot right now. Everytime he hits the mound it will be a mental battle with him instead of just throwing it.

  167. Grey

    Grey says:
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    @Infamous: All depends on who they are. Martin’s a catcher and struggling. That’s not going to get you much. Carlos Pena just hit his 9th homer, that would get you more.

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